Anti-Scottish Racism?
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My campaign to stop Brown becoming UK Prime Minister seems to be gathering a small head of steam. Eighteen days after I published the article, and the associated logos started appearing around the blogsphere, the Scotsman reported that the Conservatives planned to make an issue of it: |
Mr Vaizey broadened that argument yesterday, questioning whether a Scottish MP should head the UK government. Mr Brown's nationality raised legitimate constitutional questions about having a prime minister who represents a seat north of the Border, said the MP for Wantage, Oxfordshire.
"The situation will be thrown into stark relief if we have a prime minister who is in charge of the manifesto and driving through a domestic agenda whose constituency is in Scotland," Mr Vaizey told The Scotsman yesterday.
"The new West Lothian question is an issue that will bubble up to the surface more often.
"There is an elephant in the room which is being addressed, which is, if Scotland has devolution, then Scottish MPs should not be responsible for putting through controversial legislation. That will be thrown into stark relief if we have a prime minister from Scotland."
But it's not all been good news. Blogging journalist Paul Linford has opinioned that my campaign 'doesn't seem so very far away from the sort of "send the buggers home" saloon-bar racism which still exists in some inner-city areas where racial tensions are high.' And in yesterday's Glasgow Herald Ian MacWhirter also plays the race card:
Think of the converse: the proposition that Gordon Brown should not be prime minister because he is Scottish. Scotland is part of the United Kingdom; we have a unitary parliament, so it would be absurd – indeed, racist – to suggest that he could not be prime minister.
It seems that the question of Brown's eligibility to be Prime Minister is an issue whose time has come. What part my little campaign has played in this is unclear - more credit can probably be attributed to the Chancellor's absurd appeals for British unity - but I would like to quash any suggestions that I am motivated by 'racism' (not that Scots are a different race to the English anyway).
Following is a letter sent to the Herald in reply to Ian MacWhirter.
Sir, in his article “Why the English want to let sleeping Jocks lie” Ian MacWhirter contends that it is racist to object to Gordon Brown becoming Prime Minister on the basis of his ethnicity. That may be so but the objection to a Brown premiership rests not on his ethnicity but on his constituency.
Not only should Brown desist in voting on English-only legislation – votes for which the concomitant legislation has been devolved to the Scottish Parliament – but he should never be allowed to head up a UK executive, selecting cabinet ministers for English ministries, to formulate and administer Government policy concerning England. Gordon Brown is democratically unaccountable to any electorate – Scottish or English - over vast swathes of Government policy; all those areas that have been devolved to Scotland, but which in England remain the responsibility of the UK Government.
If it is racist to object to Prime Minister Brown voting and asking questions on English domestic policy then the corollary of that must be that it is also racist to object to a Prime Minister from an English constituency voting on Scottish domestic policy. Yet that is exactly what devolution has achieved; Blair cannot vote or even ask or answer questions on matters devolved to Scotland.
Brown lacks both the mandate and the moral authority to govern England, and if he becomes Prime Minister this fact will be used as a stick to beat him regardless of whether or not he does a good job. This is the problem with asymmetric devolution, a legacy for which Gordon Brown himself should shoulder at least some of the responsibility.
I will do all that I can to make this keep this issue smouldering for the duration of Blair's leadership. It is my ardent hope that when Prime Minister Brown - or conceivably John Reid - steps up to the despatch box to address the House on English matters he will be barracked by calls of "No Mandate!". And when it does finally become clear that a Scottish politician cannot rise to the position of Prime Minister then the union itself is at risk.
It's hard for me to argue against meritocracy, and in principle I believe that the Prime Minister should be the best man for the job regardless of where he is elected. However, regardless of merit, and in the interests of democracy, Gordon Brown should not be allowed to become Prime Minister.
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Awww the poor victims aint
Awww the poor victims aint whining again. They are that arrogant. I cant even be bothered with them any more. Giving it the big 'un about how great you are (we invented everything), even though you've been living off another people for the last 300 years.
Even when they have the chance to grow up and go it alone, they don't. Pathetic indeed and then to whine about getting the treatment YOU have been giving others for years on top of that. Well, that sums up just how arrogant and pathetic they are. I am anti tony blair, sure I am. I didnt think tony blair was scottich thopugh? Hmmmm? ha! ha!
As a Scotsman I can only say
As a Scotsman I can only say you are welcome to Gordon (lets all be british) Brown. It may surprise you to know (well, maybe not you Gareth) that I dont know any Scots that think it fair for our MP`s to vote on English matters. Its has sweet f*** all to do with us. Lets keep it simple without all the childish crap, You lot dont want us and we dont want you, we have the same agenda!!
Hopefully we will all get our wish sooner rather than leter.
Saor Alba.
Doesn't surprise me in the
Doesn't surprise me in the slightest Neilly - opinion polls show that the Scots think it even more unfair than the English, though that may have something to do with the fact that the Scots have a political class and press that educates them on the facts of devolution.
Gareth, we share the same
Gareth, we share the same surname. Heres a link that may be of interest to you;
www.electricscotland.com/webclans/stoz/young2.html
Enjoy :)
Given that Scots is an
Given that Scots is an English dialect, and that Scotland was settled by anglo-saxons, is is hardly surprising that we share the same surname Neil.
I lived in Scotland up until a year ago so I am aware of the Young Clan, I've even seen their tartan in a little shop on The Mile. Indeed, I've even drunk the odd pint of Younger's Tartan Special in my time; I used to be able to see the brewery from my bedroom window - the smell of yeast was quite overpowering at times.
I'm from the Yorkshire clan of Youngs, as you can see from the surname profiler there are a lot of us up there. I believe that my paternal grandmother had Scottish roots but she was not a Young.
Scotland settled by the anglo
Scotland settled by the anglo saxons? thats new to me Gareth, when did that happen. Are you referring to all the white settlers we have here?
Incidentally Scots is a language in itself, the same as english is its own language. Both derive from the germanic angles but are different because both have had totally different linguistic influences put on them by other languages and cultures throughout the centuries. You would be just as correct say that the english language is a dialect of Scots or you could say that both countries speak particularly bad German!
Yes, I am aware that there are some Youngs in yorkshire, can only assume they are descended from someScots who did a bit of business in York when they were with Bonnie Prince Charlie in the 45! Only kidding, though theres no doubt that Young is a very popular surname in Scotland (a lot more so than in england) but it is a bit of a generic surname and can be found in many different spellings in lots of cultures, og in Gaelic, junge in German etc..
The Anglo-Saxons settled much
The Anglo-Saxons settled much of lowland Scotland, that's were Scots came from.
We have an even bigger problem with white settlers in England, over 10% of the people born in Scotland now live in England. The noblest prospect a Scotsman ever sees...
Gareth youre a funny guy! The
Gareth youre a funny guy! The anglo saxons settled north of the border from england where they were absorbed into Scottish society (that being mainly Scots, Brithons and Picts). The Scots were from Argyll (part of Dalriada) in the West of Scotland. Tell you what Gareth, you stop trying to tell me your misinformed views about my countries history and I will stop telling you about yours (oh, wait hold on I never have done as Im not that arrogantor that informed, not that its stops you ) Also for an englishman you seem to talk about Scotland and her history a lot. Are u jealous of our culture and the fact your country doesnt seem to have one? Hopefully Gareth some of these people born in Scotland that are now living in your poxy country are the children of white settlers who realise they are not wanted. We do not want them tainting our gene pool.
Charming, a Scottish
Charming, a Scottish eugenecist.
The anglo-saxons settled some of East Scotland, and quite a few English fled to Scotland when the Normans conquered England. Stop trying to paint Scotland as a separate race, your Celtic revisionist history might wash with some people but not with me.
Nobody, least of all me, is denying that Scotland has a unique culture and history. Why not be proud of the fact instead of disparaging England's culture?
Hilarious that Neilly is
Hilarious that Neilly is trying to tout Northumbrian English as the Scots "language". That's only because he can't be bothered to learn Scots Gaelic!
"Tainting our gene pool"?
"Tainting our gene pool"? Racist, ignorant little Scotlander. You don't want to encourage this sort of nonsense, Gareth.
Gareth - speaking as a
Gareth - speaking as a half-Scot, I recommend you don't dignify this twit's messages with a reply. For a start, they're getting racist and offensive, for a second he can't spell or tell the difference between a dialect or a language. I don't believe that intelligent, reasoned argument would ever penetrate the dark, empty chasms of his brain. He lowers the tone, as we say in England.
Many Scots would be ashamed of him, too. He is not representative of the majority, as you well know.
Don't waste your time. He'll bring his mates along next, and then it'll be gob till breakfast.
Neilly, can we have our
Neilly, can we have our goalposts back? And you can have Tony, Gordon, and all the rest.
You guys are hilarious. Call
You guys are hilarious. Call me a racist when all you can do is denegrate my country and countrymen.
At least we have a common cause. Good luck in your campaign for an english parliament.
Saor Alba.
United by Scottish football
United by Scottish football ?
Why not try it ?
www.Internetfootball.co.uk
SAOR ALBA We want nothing to
SAOR ALBA
We want nothing to do with england. Scotland can and will suvive on its own. no one like the english, when i am abroad poeple dont speak to me because i speak english, then whe they understand i am Scottish, they buy me drinks, and chat for hours. you are not wanted anywhere.
SAOR ALBA
hold on guys, this is getting
hold on guys, this is getting just a wee bit out of controll and a wee bit away from the topic, as a Scotsman my opinion is that untill Scotland becomes completly independant there should be no position in government unavailable to any capable scot involved, i say capable because if not for the inherant racism in your cause i would be on your side, Gordon simply isnt capable. On the topic of racism im pretty disgusted in what ive read here from both "sides." It saddens me to think we cannot all learn to get along after so many people have sacrificed their lives, especially on what is a tiny piece of land. None of us were alive at stirling, falkirk, bannockburn or flodden
I know this post is old but
I know this post is old but anyway...
"Scots" is not a language; it is a dialect. Get over it Neilly.
"Scots" was called "Inglis" for over 300 years! Look it up.
Comment from Alba Rebel
Time: July 31, 2006, 11:15 pm
We want nothing to do with england. Scotland can and will suvive on its own. no one like the english, when i am abroad poeple dont speak to me because i speak english, then whe they understand i am Scottish, they buy me drinks, and chat for hours. you are not wanted anywhere.
"no one like the English"? Hmmm, English need to be speak proper like jimmy! You don't even sound scottish to me. Plus, you've got the same spelling technique that Neilly has. You are Neilly. ha!
Youre not wanted anywhere?
Oh for crying out loud, stop ranting you pathetic scotch bigot! It's people like you who dont like English folks. I live in the USA and people here think my accent is great 99% of the time. Infact, they make a point of asking me all kinds of questions about what England is like, where in England i'm from, and how they would "love" to go to England one day! So, stick your prejudiced shite as far up yer jacksy as you can get it jimmy!
Oh, and stop begging off English folks. It only makes you look like immature, pathetic hypocrites! Do you have no pride or integrity?
Chris, pretty much hits the
Chris, pretty much hits the nail on the head.
Tommy, you can have your goalposts and you can keep Tony, Gordon and the rest ;) ... how generous it that!
back on topic ... the problem as I see it is not strictly that a Scotsman (or an MP for a Scottish constituency) is Prime Minister (although Gordon Brown clearly is a problem). The problem is the devolution settlement, in which case there are only three reasonable solutions which I can identify.
1. A federal UK, with each nation state with a parliament of equivalient powers ... a 'devolution max' as some unionists have touted it.
2. A parliament in each nation with powers equivelant to that of the Holyrood parliament and with powers to that level and no more (i.e. no real tax raising powers, reserving these to westminster)
3. Repeal of the Act of Union providing for complete seperation of Scotland from the rest of the UK (obviously this would mean that be definition there would be no resident Scots in westminster.)
I know which solution I'd prefer and 1. and 2. would allow an MP sitting in a Scottish seat to hold any office without any real concern as to where he comes from.
I suppose England could also be regionalised with each area having an assembly, although I understand that this is not a popular idea.
Is it anti-Scottish racism to not want an MP for a Scottish constituency as Prime Minister? No, that in it's self cannot be seen in that light. However, how this is manifesting itself in some sectors can certainly be considered borderline racism at best.
What a lot of arrogant
What a lot of arrogant pathetic whingeing. Yes, it is racist to not want someone for a particular office because of their nationality within the UK. We are all British within the UK like it or not, and I would rather have people of ability with strong values and character than anybody I have seen post on this page. I feel ashamed to share a country with (most) of you - you know who you are!